6l80 vs 10l80 transmission

GM now also offers both 8- and 10-speed automatics. It all comes down to the extra rigidity and flatness of the surfaces. Each clutch is controlled by a corresponding shift solenoid A-F. The TCM-2600/2650 is used to enable the use of the GM 6l50e, 6L80E, 6l90E, 6T70E and 6T75 E transmissions behind practically any engine. Do you know does the aftermarket have a fix? They are listed as Type A, Type B, and Type C diagnostic trouble codes. Upon full inspection, the unit is loaded with metal, and the pump (bell housing) is worn to the point of needing remachining or replacement. This platform did not get Gen 4 (58x CKP) engines until 2008. This idler gear and ball bearing assembly is mounted to the stator shaft support housing. The way the power is applied is different than the 4L80E / TH-400. Customers' pictures and movies from drag racing competitions. The ideal upgrade for modified performance vehicles, Sonnax 3-bolt adapter flange yoke kit T35-GMFD-01K makes it easy to convert a two-piece driveline to a one-piece, U-joint-style driveline. Copyright 2006-2020 GEARS Magazine. The following drivability conditions will be present when this type of DTC is stored. Second 2.99 This is a completely new and different transmission compared to the 4L80E. Thats more than almost any other GM automatic transmission. If the power circuit to the transmission solenoids fails open, then all solenoids are failed electrically off. But the cause he discovered was related to the pump. Wait 2 seconds. GM Transmission Dimensions - Pace Performance and it can handle a total gross vehicle weight of 8,600 lb, which makes it a great transmission for LS swaps with no modification needed whatsoever. Upon a test drive and a scan, code P0741 is noted and the percentage of TCC slip shows to be way out of range. Shift the transmission to Neutral. If the warmer is not mounted to the transmission, refer to factory information to locate it. LS Swap Automatic Transmission Guide - Chevy Hardcore LS 3 has a Big Turbo on it, I am only worried about rear gear, rest I have help with, Car never went over 130 or it red lined with Big Block, Never was a highway car, It has a 373 or a 323 in it, Not a 411 I know that much, Thats all, Im building a gen one Camaro and Ive purchased lt4 supercharged motor for it I was wanting to know if you know the difference in size for 10 speed transmission to a turbo 400 I need to know how much to raise my floor pan at tunnel and about how much fire wall to cut out. Here's Why The 10R80 Is The Best 10 Speed Transmission - HotCars The thicker JMBX piston cant conform to the cover (like it can in the 4L60-E TMBX), and at a commanded slip rate of approximately 50 RPMs in lockup, there is ultimately metal-to-metal contact that occurs between the front cover and the piston. The Nightmare on Oak Street: A hunt for 4L30E electrical problems How. The 4L80 features a 310 mm torque converter. Getrag 260 5-speed longitudinal manual made by Getrag. The 6L80 was approved for use in these vehicles weighing up to 8600 lbs. 6L80/90E Swap FAQS | Chevy Trailblazer SS Forum Lets talk about some of the concerns and fixes we have been seeing. 8L80E PATC Sells GM 6L80E Transmissions, Torque Converters and Parts At the current time, the only way to use a GM 6 or 8-speed automatic is to tie it in with a GM engine like the LS3 and use the engine controller to work with transmission. I believe the last digits of the model number are the power rating capabilities of the transmission. Before answering that question, its worth noting the role that Sonnax plays in the converter rebuilding business. If you have any questions that I may be able to help you with, drop a comment or contact me. It probably wont do much for the elapsed time which is all that really matters. $ 439.00 Select options. GM Transmissions that work with a Vortec or LS Motor While Sonnax makes every effort to ensure the accuracy of technical articles at time of publication, we assume no liability for inaccuracies or for information which may become outdated or obsolete over time. In 1987, he assumed the role of editor for Hot Rod magazine before returning to his first love of writing technical stories. Its only about a 3/4-inch band around the inside circumference of the converter. One needs to realize that the stamped covers are not all that flat to begin with. and can weigh up to ~230 lbs. Just keep scanning it until you find the one you are looking for. GM has been useless to say the least, and waited me out (now off warranty). A 2005 Ford F350 with the 6.0 liter diesel engine and 5R110W transmission has set a P0753 Pressure Control Solenoid A - Electrical Fault code and a P2700 Transmission Friction Element A - Apply Time Out Of Range code. It also contains a durable transmission pan, reliable gear seat, EPC, a 13-vane pump assembly, high-performance cooler, hardened stator shaft with rings and specialized control solenoids. A used 10L80 is pulled from a wrecked vehicle, so theres no telling what may be wrong with it, or how long it will last. This transmission makes an excellent conversion transmission due to its adaptability into most Jeeps longer than CJ5s. Weight 230+ lbs (weight varies depending on application) Team ATF builder Super Dave doing his magic on assembling the First 10L80 transmission ATFSpeed has had come thru the shop. TSB 18-NA-026 Transmission fluid leak To achieve this flip-flopped damper orientation in the JMBX, the profile and shape of the piston is radically different from the TMBX. As you build the best transmission that you can for your customer, you should consider including an updated torque converter in the repair estimate. All Rights Reserved. Statements on 6L80E trans with LS engine. Tenth 0.64 Shop Finder PDF Service Bulletin - National Highway Traffic Safety Administration Made of billet aluminum with included swivel -6 AN fittings with 3/8" barbs. Larry Callahan Founder/Administrator of Pro-Touring.com, G-Machines.com and HostMyJunk.com To advertise on Pro-Touring.com click here The 6L90 transmission is slightly longer and taller than a comparable configuration 6L80 due to its beefier internals. The HydraMatic can be adapted to the popular Jeep transfer cases, including the: Essentially all factory GM 4wd applications available with an OEM configured 6L80 have adapters and transfer cases that are prohibitively long for a Jeep, and transfer cases whose sizes and gearing fall short of desirable for most Jeep applications. Because of this, the 6L80 - despite having two or three more gears than its predecessors, is unexpectedly short in length. This creates an uneven force on the clutches that tends to . Theres also a unique internal thermal bypass that allows the transmission to warm up faster, reducing fuel consumption on cold starts. General Motors 6L80-E & 6L90-E Transmission Problems & Solutions It is an incredibly advanced transmission and has the technology to . But in order to make this work properly, they began by making the overall First gear ratio deeper. It can also be found in the Lincoln Navigator. 10R80/10L90 Ford & GM Ten Speed Unique Filter System - Transmission Digest Its a single-disc, non-captive clutch unit that is somewhat similar to late 300mm 4L60-E converters. The 6L80 / 6L90 TEHCM is located inside of the transmission on the 6L80 / 6L90 valve body. In this video I show how to change flush the transmission fluid and filter on a 2012 Chevrolet Silverado with 6.2L with the 6 speed automatic 6L80E The exceptions to this would be the 2006-2014 Corvette, 2006 G8, 2010-2015 Camaro, and the Chevrolet SS. or gross weight of 14,000 lbs. Thats pretty much all thats to it. Why the thin woven carbon clutch doesnt typically fail in the 4L60-E TMBX. Also, Im not sure if the trans will allow converter lockup at WOT. 2020 10l80 4wd an I one to convert to 2wd. The transmission can also signal the engine to drop power during a shift if there's a possibility of clutch damage. 97 it's a, I have a 2007 h3 hummer base model. Do you think that I might pick up a few more hundredths if I switch the lock on say when I hit second? They all look really similar, so make sure that you bother to count the pan gasket bolts, especially if you have an untrained eye. 10L80 vs 10L90 Transmissions. But, GM had been in transmission limbo, so to speak, needing a modern transmission to fill the duty gap between the excellently versatile4L60E (and its tougher 4L65 & 4L70 variants)and the Allison transmissions. LS/6L80E into G Body (El Camino) - GBodyForum However some 2wd vans and HD truck versions had a, J Series Trucks & Wagons, (I6 Then, because the six-speed is splitting ratios, the rpm drop between gears is less because TCI has turned this into a five-speed automatic with an overdrive. The 6L80 has surprised us power transmission aficionados with its wholesale adoption of new and very different technologies. LS2/TH400 vs L92/6L80e | Pirate 4x4 Conveniently, the main transmission that the 6L80E is going to be confused for all have a different number of pan gasket bolts. To be honest, we arent 100% sure of the real reason for JMBX cover and piston failure, but we do have a theory. I have a 2wd 2000 regular cab stepside bed Silverado that used to make closer to 600-650 wheel horsepower with the D1-SC Procharger and 4L80E. Copyright 2023 - Transmission Repair Cost Guide. The 6L80 would have big shoes to fill, with legendary predecessors like the TH400, 4L80E and 4L60E transmissions. Engine | Drivetrain | Powertrain Technical Discussions, https://www.delphi.com/dynamic-skip-fire-1. The 6L80E uses four under drive gears and two overdrive gears. This version is 1-3/8" longer and about 25% of its internal parts differ. The Sonnax forged covers and pistons are designed to be flat and will stay that way through the forces of converter welding, miles of driving and varying input torque from the engine. Seems like the 6 speed auto would be better for the torque curve. The check engine light might be on, and the customer complains of a slipping sensation with intermittent clunks. 2nazty New Member. The question is will the 10L80 be as strong as the 10L90? 2) Trans vertical position is the same on 200-4R,700R4,4L60,4L65,70E,6L80E. Then it can upshift to one of its three overdrive gears for maximum fuel economy. and GCVW of 21,000 lbs. The Novak Guide to the GM 6L80 Automatic Transmission For all practical purposes, these two transmissions are completely interchangeable. The CIDAS (Casting Integrated Direct Acting Solenoid) are all normally low solenoids. There are too many differences between in communication protocols and renders the transmission nonfunctional. Do you thing the 10L80 can be beefed up using 10L90 parts? RPO Code MF6 Trans temps climbed to 195 and has stayed there ever since. The button for Tap control is on the top of the shifter, making it easy to use in both left and right hand drive vehicles. Internally they are very different but at least with the 8l90 you do not need to completely disassemble the transmission to convert to 4wd from 2wd. 6L80/90 - 8L90 Floor Tap Shifter Kit. In fact, the only 2017 model year vehicle that still comes with this transmission is the Chevrolet SS. Comes with a complete harness and the necessary software to program the TCM-2650 Module. The 4L80E is a very large, heavy transmission but, like its original TH-400 cousin, it can absorb and transmit an enormous amount of engine torque. But keeping the engine in its ideal RPM range allows the 10L80 transmission to operate with nearly the efficiency of a CVT transmission. Ask Away! with Jeff Smith: Explaining 6-, 8-, and 10 - OnAllCylinders 10L80 vs 10L90 - CAMARO6 Renew Subscription Ive not done the math on total surface area, but its likely the clutch would not last long engaging 450 hp. Now controlled by computers, the E series transmission allowed for a wide range of tuning options. Account. During the inspection of the transmission, Brain noticed that the idler gear could be easily lifted off of the bearing with just the use of his fingers (see figures 2 and 3). Smith began writing for Car Craft magazine in 1979 and became editor in 1984. When cutting the JMBX open, converter rebuilders report that a high percentage of units show extreme damage due to the clutch piston and front cover crashing into each other (Figure 1). to 885 ft. Also fits '05-'06 Pontiac GTO (differential side). I see where Summit Racing lists a TCI transmission that was originally a 4L80E but they list it as a six-speed transmission. Efficiency and performance are the two main goals behind the GM 10L80 transmission. First, check for updated programming for the TCM strategy. CDT 10L80 Bench Rebuild. Sonnax 3-Bolt Adapter Flange Yoke Kit - T35-GMFD-01K GM LS1 - 9 and Chrysler/Mopar Gen III & Viper V10, Chevrolet Transmissions with Dimensions and Fluid Capacity, Chrysler Transmissions with Dimensions and Fluid Capacity, Ford Transmissions with Dimensions and Fluid Capacity, Torque Converters with Dimensions and Fluid Capacity, TH700R4 / 4L60E / 4L65E Stage II - Stage V, 6L80E / 6L90E Frn Std till 1000Hp version, 6L80E / 6L90E From Stock to 1000Hp version. Objectively, it is a fairly simple repair: simply remove the transmission pan, remove the valve body, unbolt the TEHCM from the valve body and install the new one. The GM Hydramatic 6L80 transmission heralds a significant change in the design of automatic transmissions at General Motors. Most of the larger displacement applications will have an auxiliary oil-to-air cooler in the system as well. How do Sonnax components prevent the failure that plagues these units? Sometimes, finding the cause of a complaint isnt as straightforward as one would expect; sometimes, these causes can be very elusive. Members Trying to decide if its worth upgrading for the 10L80 alone. Hi Jeff, I have a 2016 Silverado with the 5.3 and the 8 speed transmission. A sectioned image of the 4L60-E TMBX and 6L80, 6L90 JMBX (Figure 3) shows the external profiles of the respective front covers are very similar. The taper may exist so that the clutch surface goes flat when the cover is welded together were not sure. DESIGNED FOR GEN V LT1 & LT4 ONLY. The stator shaft support housing comes with these gears as one assembly. For a type B code, the fault must be present after two consecutive ignition cycles, otherwise, the MIL will not illuminate (however, a pending code will store). Sonnax is an industry leader in the cutting edge design, manufacture and distribution of the highest quality products to the automotive aftermarket, commercial vehicle industries, and industrial sectors utilizing drivetrain technology. Inspect the warmer for damage and related lines for leaks (Figure 4). The solenoids can be replaced separately, but only with the same type of solenoid. Special tools are often needed when diagnosing transmission problems and overhauling units. 8 Options if Your Transmission Has Failed, Transmission Diagnostic Trouble Codes (DTC), Best Remanufactured Transmission Companies, Hybrid Battery Replacement Cost and Prices, 10 Most Common Transmission Problems & How to Fix Them, How to Change Transmission Fluid Step by Step, What is a Transmission Flush? This creates the situation where the engine drops less rpm from First to Second gear. yr=d.getFullYear(); So you would need to begin with a 2008 or newer Express to be able to convert from a 4L80 to a 6L80 / 6L90. Maximum engine input torque for the 6L80 is 440 ft. lbs. But look at the clutch pistons and spring dampers they are markedly different. That way you get a longer service life, along with a 3-year/Unlimited Mile Nationwide Warranty.. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Even though it has two more gears, creative packaging allows the 10L80 transmission to be no bigger or heavier than an 8L90 or 6L90. How quickly time passes by. Lots of good information I do have one question That no one seems to be able to give a good answer to. Applications. Subscribe Now In addition to developing innovative, quality repairs for transmissions, Sonnax is also the premier, full-line supplier of components to the torque converter remanufacturing industry. It's RPO code is "MYC" and it is domestically manufactured in GM's Ypsilanti, Michigan plant. Indirectly affects shift pressure control. Shift the transmission to Reverse. I work on other peoples vehicles for a living. Although the basic engineering is the same, the GM 10L80 and Ford 10R80 each have proprietary control software, along with a few other differences that are suited for each specific application. PDF PIP5477C 10L90 10L80 10 Speed Automatic Transmission Exchange Program For the most part, this transmission has been phased out by the 8L90E already, but is still in prodution. 6L80E / 6L90E 4-5-6 Clutch. Beyond that, its probably not a good idea even if it will allow lockup because that clutch surface area is limited. The 6L80 / 6L90 uses three-way solenoids and variable bleed solenoids for improved shift quality. Chevrolet Transmission Dimensions Dimension "C" is the distance from the bellhousing to the center of the transmission mounting pad. Both 2wd and 4wd versions of the 6L80 can be used equally well, and there are no inherent advantages to either one once you have installed our adapter assembly. Reactions: me32. If you have your heart set on a six-speed automatic to back your LS, consider TCI's 6X transmission. This is a normal and desired behavior. As an example, combining the TCI Six-speeds 2.97:1 First gear with a 3.50:1 rear gear ratio is equal to a traditional TH-400 (or stock 4L80E) with a 4.19:1 rear gear. This wavy nature of the clutch surface is made worse with many miles of usage. * An extension housing p/n 8673406 (old p/n 24214689) is available for the TH700R4/4L60 transmission that moves the rear transmission mount to the same position as a TH400 (short-style 4" tail) or TH200-4R transmission. Sonnax highlights two product lines for helping with heavy solenoids for GM/Ford 10L/10R and 9T series transmissions. The GM transmission is the 10L80, which is available in several models as well. 8l90 vs 10l80 - Surabayapestcontrol.com TAP-2000 is a floor mounted shifter with Tap up Tap Down for GM 6/8L80/90E transmissions. This allows him to see what kinds of issues some of these transmissions come back to the dealer with while under warranty. Reply. The 6l80E transmission are the same through the entire line with changes made thru production in electronics. This 7-3/8" long extension housing can eliminate transmission crossmember modifications when replacing a TH400 or TH200-4R transmission with a 4L60 assembly. Use it to verify the vehicle has a M30 4L60ENow, if the transmission is out of the vehicle (or if you dont trust a sticker), the 6L80E has an 18 bolt case. We pride ourselves in staying at the forefront of our industry, technology, research & development and our commitment to you, our customer. But the replacement of this assembly requires new bolts. With a dry weight of approximately 230 lbs, its also very light considering the complexity. It employs an even deeper First gear ratio of 4.02:1 with tighter gear splits but does not apply an overdrive for subsequent gears. Eighth 0.85 GM 6L80E and 8L90E Drag Race Transmissions - ATI Racing Our simulations reveal that this is worth anywhere from 0.10 to perhaps 0.15-second in a quarter-mile comparison between a stock 4L80E and a TCI Six-Speed. This seems to indicate that there will be other 10L80 transmissions that will be experiencing this same new kind of pump noise condition. Read more columns from our Shift Pointers series here. Now it has RPM Level 6 but if a 6L80E or 6L90E swap was introduced or even the 8 and 10 transmissions it would be a game changer. Convert your american classic car with more modern technology. General 10-speed automatic with integral turbine clutch torque converter In contrast, when the 10-speed transmission is at heavy or max throttle, the small steps keep the engine closer to the horsepower peak for the best performance. Required fields are marked *. Ford is currently using this unit in the following vehicles: The 10R80 has ten forward speeds, one reverse speed produced through the following components: The 10R80 utilizes six shift solenoids that are listed by the factory as A-F and are linear force solenoids (Figure 1). This means that its designed for rear wheel drive vehicles only. Thanks Jeff. Double-step (skipping a gear) upshifts results when a longer time is spent in gear. And with four gearsets and six clutches (2 brake, 4 rotating), the 10L80 10-speed has just one more clutch than the 8L90 8-speed transmission (this is partly because of a unique triple-clutch assembly mounted near the middle of the case). 10L80 Performance Transmission Rebuilds | Circle D Transmission Its a little tough to see, but the thickness of the pistons is also different. What is a good torque converter today for a 4.3 high output 4 wheel drive Blazer? A horsepower revolution spawned by GM's increasingly powerful Gen. III+ V8 engines and their aggressive platforms such as the Cadillac STSV, XLRV, various trucks and SUV's and the venerable Corvette.

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